I Know It’s Over

By Kevin Whitcher

Online Ed: Wenger further away from Champions League glory than ever

Hubris. Defined as excessive pride or self-confidence. Synonyms: arrogance, conceit, conceitedness, haughtiness, pride, vanity, self-importance, self-conceit, pomposity, superciliousness, feeling of superiority, (in Greek tragedy) excessive pride towards or defiance of the gods, leading to nemesis.

Pride certainly came before a fall in Munich last night, as Arsene Wenger was once again exposed as a manager who is incapable of organising his teams to counter the strengths of the opposition. Arjen Robben is lethal on his left foot, so one can only imagine the players were not instructed in advance to show him onto his right, which would explain Francis Coquelin’s rather strange attempt to prevent his shooting by doing exactly the opposite when Bayern scored their first goal.

I titled my piece on the Hull match after a Smiths song (Hand In Glove), so on that theme, I’ll stick with Morrissey and co for the following game. Equally suitable could have been The Art of Falling Apart, History Repeating or Go Now.

The best thing Arsene Wenger can do to salvage the situation is to come out and state that he will call it a day at the end of this season and let someone else have a go. That way, those that will still attend the matches between now and the end of May can get behind the team knowing the slow torture of repeated predictable failures is finally coming to an end, and just maybe a top four place can be salvaged. With a kind draw, there could even be an FA Cup to go out on a high. Although right now, people are wondering if, with Gabriel in defence, the Gunners might even go out to non-league Sutton United on Monday night.

Arsenal did stage a recovery in Munich after going a goal down, and a decent spell in the first half included Sanchez scoring from the rebound after a poor penalty was saved by Neuer. Both sides had some very decent chances in a cracking first half, and at the interval, there was at least some hope of coming away with a result. But shortly after half time, Koscielny did his hamstring, Gabriel entered the fray, and that was pretty much that for Arsenal’s chances. So much for “the best squad I’ve ever worked with” then. The Gunners were dismantled once their captain left the pitch.

The capability of Xhaka and Coquelin to counter Bayern’s midfield was questionable, and they were effectively a man light with Ozil showing his usual lack of interest in getting involved in the unglamorous stuff (unlike Sanchez up front). So Arsenal were predictably outnumbered. Francis Coquelin won a solitary tackle all night. But the selection of the wide attackers had me worried most of all. Walcott on the bench – good call. On his sofa back in the UK with his coffee-making machine would have been even better, but you can’t have everything. Yet, the Ox and Iwobi to cover the forward forays of Alaba and Lahm? And also assist their full backs against Douglas Costa and Robben? Come on. The game called for more experience – specifically Welbeck and Perez as the two wide players. The latter wasn’t even on the bench. Bayern’s second goal saw Lahm unchallenged as he put the ball on a plate for Lewandowski. You could feel already there would be more goals.

The Arsenal line-up were not playing as a team, with only selective players pressing rather than them operating together, much to the frustration of Sanchez. Thiago was bossing the midfield, and scored the third all too easily as Bayern cut the Gunners apart like a hot knife through butter. Bayern had two slow centre halves who were there for the taking, but Arsenal could not sort themselves out, were not playing like an effective unit, and gave their hosts far too much of the ball. The game was very open, which might have suited Wenger’s team under different circumstances, but the amount of space they gave to Carlo Ancelotti’s team was the kind of stuff you normally need a NASA telescope to capture. They were punished accordingly. In spite of conceding five, there is a case for David Ospina as being Arsenal’s best player, with the number of saves he made. It was that bad.

It was 4-1 after 62 minutes thanks to a deflected goal, and shortly after, Walcott replaced Iwobi. It was officially hide behind the sofa time. Going for a second goal to give his team some hope in the second leg, the manager put on Giroud for Coquelin. That meant the Ox dropping back alongside Xhaka, with the predictable result of a fifth Bayern goal as the Ox decided to show his skills on the edge of his own area instead of playing a simple pass out to the unmarked Gibbs. 5-1. The same scoreline as last year’s group stage match at the same venue. Arsenal’s lack of progress was there in the numbers, although this mattered more than a group game.

Even less surprising than Arsenal getting walloped was Granit Xhaka picking up a yellow card. He’s a player that has looked good on occasion, but last night, he looked out of his depth. Maybe the club should have tried a bit harder to sign N’golo Kante. The game was the story of the Emirates years encapsulated in 90 minutes. Brief hope, promises of something special before reality dawns and Arsenal fall way short. At 3-1 up, Bayern took their foot off the gas, but still scored two more.

Be careful what you wish for, those who prefer the manager to remain espouse. Really? Can it get any worse than this? Luis Enrique, who has won two La Liga titles, a Champions League and two Copa del Reys in his three seasons at Barcelona, will be dispensed with in the summer because of the four goal defeat in Paris. Roberto Di Matteo was sacked by Chelsea halfway through the season after he led the team to the Champions League because of his failure to get his team out of the group stage. Football is a ruthless business… everywhere but Arsenal. So complacency is king, “Mental strength” a fallacy trotted out by the manager. He is taking £8.3 million a year out of the club (officially) plus bonuses. Which indicates that his remit isn’t winning trophies but turning profit. It’s football Jim, but not as we knew it.

In every year since the stadium move, Arsenal have qualified for the Champions League and made it into the knockout rounds. So, 11 campaigns. In that time, Arsenal have won four knockout ties. Four ties in 11 seasons. They have progressed beyond the last 16 three times out of 11. For the record, the ties they have won were Milan (2008 – the last time Arsenal eliminated a genuine European giant), Roma (on penalties) and Villarreal (2009), and Porto (2010). Since 2010, the club have failed to progress beyond the round of 16 in seven attempts (let’s assume they do not beat Bayern 4-0 in the second leg). Granted, on five of the last seven seasons they have faced either Barcelona or Bayern. But hey, if you are serious about winning the trophy, you know what… you have to eliminate top sides at some stage. Arsenal even had the advantage of the second leg at home this season. But the manager did not prepare his team tactically for the opposition. Hence they were over-ran in midfield, hence the two wide attackers failed to support their full backs adequately and hence Francis Coquelin showed Arjen Robben onto his stronger foot for the opening goal. Arsene Wenger has never won a European trophy and that is because ultimately, along the way you cannot just rely on good fortune, but need some tactical astuteness to beat different opposition. Ozil should have been dropped for this leg with someone prepared to harry picked in his place.

The Champions League is the one trophy Wenger covets above any other because it is a glaring omission on his CV. And it will remain one because if he could not win it with the players he had between his arrival at Arsenal and his breaking up of the Invincibles, he never will. The final this year is in Cardiff, the scene of three FA Cup triumphs. Wenger may well be there, but only in the stands as a guest of UEFA. How much more humiliation can the man take? At £8.3 million a year to do what he likes, the fear is another couple of years’ worth.

However, the tide is turning. Even Martin Keown says the club need to work out an exit strategy. (Martin, maybe they already have. The directors have briefed people like you and their media voices like Jeremy Wilson and John Cross that there is a two year deal on the table, to make it look like it will be Arsene’s decision on when his time is called at the club – when, just perhaps, after last season’s Leicester title win they realized that they had to try something different. But everyone believes what they have been told.) John Cross has said “for the good of the club, Arsene does need to think about moving on”. This is sea change stuff we are talking here. With every no-show by his players, more and more of those who have retained faith in the manager are admitting that indeed it is ‘time for change’. They don’t want to lift banners in the stadium to humiliate the man, but inside, they know it.

It’s sad that it has come to this, but that is the nature of hubris. Arsene Wenger has never admitted that the continued failures to achieve the success the club have been set up for have been anything to do with him. There is always something else to blame – others spending more money, officials, the scheduling of the fixture list to suit TV, injuries, the supporters, the weather, players taking supplements, the list goes on. Never any personal failing, oh no. He is stubborn and proud, believing his way is the right way, yet failing to acknowledge it doesn’t work. He’s retained the same group of yes men around him on his coaching staff for years, because he wants complete control, feels he has no need of a second opinion, and does not want to be challenged by strong voices. So Steve Bould is reduced to putting out cones, Patrick Vieira waits for a call from the club when he retires and it never comes. Martin Keown has a positive influence on the defensive resilience in the 2005-06 season while doing his training badges, but when he gets some credit for it, is not invited to join the coaching set-up full time. A wealth of positive playing experience is available to the manager but he doesn’t want strong characters who might call a spade a spade and challenge the players to improve. So it’s all too cosy and comfortable, the players good enough to make the top four without exerting themselves as often as they might need to were they actually under pressure to do better. The players never fearing a rollocking from the manager. Nice work if you can get it.

One of the pundits or reporters on the TV or the radio (it might have been Pat Nevin) had a good line to the effect that Mesut Ozil is a symbol of the end of Arsene. Nice touch, but he hasn't got it when it counts. Imagine this bunch of players in the Battle of Highbury (younger readers, google it). As Michael Ballack described it, “they look like a bunch of kids”. This is what Arsenal have become under the current regime. Herbert Chapman would be spinning in his grave.

The club are trying to get to the end of the season to allow the manager a dignified exit. The only way that is going to happen now is for everyone to be told that change is on the agenda. And if they want to make it look like it is Arsene Wenger’s decision to call time on his own tenure, so be it. Just do it quickly. Because right now, the way the players are performing, it looks to me like a club in freefall. It won’t be as bad as the final days of Brian Clough at Forest, although in terms of the relationship with the supporters, there is a danger of it getting uglier if the dilly-dallying and “I’ll make my mind up in April” message continues. This was about as far as it’s possible to go from Arsenal’s first European trophy win against Anderlecht in 1970. The football club has become a laughing stock.

The board are sounding out candidates, we know that. So let’s stop the pretense, make it public that Wenger is managing his final games and try and recover what could turn out to be a shipwreck of a season, currently spiraling out of control. To quote Henry Winter, enough of this sleepwalking towards the abyss.

Ivan Gazidis in June 2013: “We want to be a club that is competing at the very top end of the game and that means competing to win the Premier League and competing to win the Champions League. We should be able to compete at a level like a club such as Bayern Munich. I'm not saying we are there by any means, we have a way to go before we can put ourselves on that level. But this whole journey over the past ten years really has been with that goal in mind which is why I say that this is an extraordinarily ambitious club.” A year later Arsene Wenger signed on for another three years after a winning an FA Cup by defeating European giants Wigan (on penalties) and Hull (in extra time). Ambitious or complacent? Let’s not make that mistake again.

Next up, Sutton United away…

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16th February 2017 10:02:25


Comments and Reaction

User comments on this article are now closed. If you want to continue the debate, why not do so on the Gooner Forum.

Jumpers For Goalposts  10:22am 16th Feb 2017

Is anybody surprised???? This has happened so many times under Wenger that we accept and expect such a pathetic surrender. When are we going to organise ourselves into a loud protest against this bloody man?? - Post No. 104049

RobG  10:27am 16th Feb 2017

I will only believe he is gone or going when e confirmation comes in. The Board are pitiful and would happily accept two more years so they can procrastinate further. AW is sadly delusional and I could still see him signing on for two more years and with 17 million reasons. I hope we get the dignified ending in May. But I won't believe it until we see it. - Post No. 104050

GSPM  10:39am 16th Feb 2017

What the Wenger issue has done is make Arsenal an un attractive club to join, quality players I think don't wants to join us while Wenger is at the helm, hence he has been shopping for bargains for a long time. As for last night, a bit of tactical knowhow should have seen us tighten up in 2nd half with Wenger making the changes at half time to park the bus and keep the score at 1-1 , or a narrow defeat, making no changes and just letting the players sort it out themselves was suicide when you consider how we were outplayed in 1st half.....The end is nigh. - Post No. 104051

King Jeremy  10:55am 16th Feb 2017

Smiths Songs....How about "That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore"? Did anyone really, deep down, expect a different result, and similarly, would anyone be at all surprised if he is STILL the manager next season? The answer to the question as to how bad it needs to get before the board act has been answered - their failure to act immediately after the game speaks volumes as to their drivers and ambitions for the club. For what it's worth: "Wenger out!" - Post No. 104052

Aylesbury Gooner  10:58am 16th Feb 2017

Good report Kevin but like most was not surprised by what happened last night.We could have gone in at half time leading 2 maybe 3-1 if we had converted our chances.The less said about the second half the better,a while back at a meeting with the press/media a reporter put the question to Wenger about lack of leaders or leadership on the pitch.We all know what he Mr Bull**** Wenger replied,unless i was watching the wrong game there was no leaders or leadership last nite on that pitch just overpaid pansies.Ozil missing in action what a waste of money, no point bringing on the carthouse as we didn't get that far forward to put a cross in anyway.a total shambles the lot of them apart from Sanchez. Wenger out,out,out - Post No. 104054

Yes its Ron  11:00am 16th Feb 2017

Hi Kev Good article, but i think that AW should be asked to resign today. In many ways, last night was a mirror of the 8-2 debacle at OT in 2011 after which i think he shd have been sacked. The club could muster a caretaker Coach until the Seasons end and it would give everyone a boost. Yes, there are those in that sqaud who would sulk and try even less, there always are but it doesn't matter as they and many in that squad need selling. Essentially, the whole squad ought to be put on notice that theyre all up for sale pending a new Coach's decision. There isnt one player there worth crying over if they left. The Seasons done. The FAC could be a bit of fun for the fans if it was no longer Wengers safety net. Hark back to the period after Bruce Rioch had gone. We did ok as a Managerless club, though i know that we had strong characters back then. Theres far too much emphasis put on the need and role of a team Coach. It can often be done as well by 2 or 3 less prominent Club stalwarts, not that many have been allowed to hang about at Arsenal under Wenger. I cant stand the bloke but they could reel Keown or his like in and ask him to prop up Bould on fixed term deals till the Season ends. The Emporor needs dethroning. Its time now. I think most supporters would support the Club doing this rather than being asked to prop up a lame duck Coach till May just to allow him a grand departure for the acolytes to throw roses and wreaths about the place dressed down with false tears. - Post No. 104055

Hi Berry  11:06am 16th Feb 2017

Further to the Gazidis quote above: I wonder how that 'on the shoulders of Europe's best' remark is sounding this morning, Ivan? - Post No. 104056

John F  11:09am 16th Feb 2017

On the radio they are saying that the contract decision has been delayed until the Summer.This can be read three ways either they are waiting until off season to announce he has signed to avoid any backlash then announce a war chest available or It is dependent on F A cup or top four or he has decided to go but doesn't want press distractions.I have a horrible feeling he will stay another year as he may also be thinking of his coaching staff who lwould likely lose their jobs when a new man comes in. Shambles is a way to describe last night and what's going on behind the scenes.The club is showing total disrespect towards the fans by keeping quiet, Wenger is by not announcing his attentions and not apologizing to our great away fans last night and the players are too by apart from the ox not even applauding them.What a bunch of tossers. - Post No. 104057

Gunner Rob  11:14am 16th Feb 2017

Even the lunatics over on Untold Arsenal are mostly now calling for Wenger to go. I suspect he will linger on until the 2nd leg and once we go out v Bayern Munich he will announce that he is going to step down at the end of the season. - Post No. 104058

Paulward  11:24am 16th Feb 2017

Completely agree Kevin, think it's just a question of how the club manage his departure now. Hindsights a wonderful thing but as it's turned out we'd have been better off losing to Hull and letting him go 3 years ago. Much as I can't wait for him to go it's hard not to be seriously worried about the future. I don't trust the board in any way shape or form and with our one top class player set to leave in the summer, a poor managerial appointment could lead to a lurch toward mid table, early eighties style. Something tells me we are going to find out who our real supporters are in the next 5 years. - Post No. 104060

The Man From UNCLE  11:27am 16th Feb 2017

In the latter days of his watch, our great club has suffered its worst ever defeats. Don't ever forget that. - Post No. 104061

burked  11:28am 16th Feb 2017

Well said Paulward - Post No. 104062

bradyorbergkamp  11:31am 16th Feb 2017

Agree with most of your blog except the behind the sofa time for me was the second goal.Do not think it will be a big problem in club management terms to replace the manager.My bet is Ivan is busting to do most of the non football work a modern MD should be doing.Get a manager to manage-no shortage of takers. The players must take a real hard look at themselves also,last nite was a shame on them also.do we still have to have that squikly line behind the letters on the code box?i find it really hard to see the code. - Post No. 104063

jeff wright  11:34am 16th Feb 2017

I was out earlier driving to the airport at 6am and heard a grief stricken John Cross on the car radio actually slating Wengo ! Yes it's true the worms such as Cross and Monkey Head have turned. Crosso said that he couldn't believe the stupidity of Wenger in playing Ospina instead of Cech who is an experienced Euro Cup winner and who actually helped Chelsea win the cup in the Bayern Munich Fussball stadium. I don't know why Cross was so surprised though that Wengo played Ospina ,who couldnt it must be said , have done anything about the BM goals,but as Cross pointed out Cech would at least have helped bring his experience to the party.Personally on reflection I doubt that it would have made any difference Ceck's been on the receiving end of a few batterings himself with us and he doesn't have Chelsea's defence in front of him and is obviously well past his sell by date. However, it does show the appalling state that our defence and GK situation is in under Wenger .Keystone Kos limping off again is being used for an excuse but the writing was already on the wall with it being unlikely that the Germa side would continue to not exploit their possession advantage ,Kos or no Kos,I mean he's not exactly TA is he ! Cross did say that he thinks it's time for Wenger to get on his bike wish us au revoir and peddle off into a setting sun with his saddle bags full of the loot that he has accumulated at AFC by winning all of those 4th place trophies. Who says that crime doesn't pay ! . Well Crosso did not exactly say that but his comments were similar in meaning. Worryingly though there is talk of an FA Cup win and top 4 place saving Wengo .Haven't we been here before >? - Post No. 104064

Yes its Ron  11:50am 16th Feb 2017

Paul Ward - yes, you never know some of the 'real' supporters might even choose return and be able to attend matches again. - Post No. 104065

Yes its Ron  12:01pm 16th Feb 2017

Jeff - Ospina was the only one who did his job last night. Hes as good as Cech. Cross and all these who constantly crow about poor old Cech being left out and who plays keeper in his place are tedious. The real and vital issues in the team that were never addressed were never fundamentally between the sticks even when Almunia was in there in my view. He just added to the underlying malaise. - Post No. 104066

foxinthebox2001  12:04pm 16th Feb 2017

This leaving it until the summer line looks rather ominous. In the meantime possible replacements will be sniffed out by less indecisive clubs, so why not pre-empt Barcelona by going after Koeman now? Its not too difficult to see the excuse being "there are no suitable alternatives" once all the suitable alternatives have already found new clubs. After all they do it every transfer window with the best players. Dither, while other clubs are doing their business. Kronke wants Wenger to stay, that much is obvious, he is the driver of his gravy train. No doubt he will be on the phone to him today, massaging his ego, telling him not to be too hasty, and things will soon get better. The transfer war chest stories get circulated, a few articles from Wenger's personal arse smoke blower, John Cross and he quietly signs for another 2 years. Where's my gun? - Post No. 104067

N-4  12:07pm 16th Feb 2017

There's only one way...stop attending games until Wenger is gone...that would wake the board up... - Post No. 104068

jeff wright  12:11pm 16th Feb 2017

Morning Ron, there is nothing between the two GK's that's for sure although there should be with Cech playing every week and with the greater experience .This shows how much he has deteriorated and why Chelsea got shut of him. Wenger used the signing of Cech at the time for an excuse to not make any other ones .If anything Ospina was our MOTM in last nigh's humbling of arrogant Arsene and Ospina let in 5 goals ! You couldn't make it up. - Post No. 104069

MAF  12:11pm 16th Feb 2017


Alsace  12:36pm 16th Feb 2017

Kevin's review excellent as usual. We are now in a critical phase. Everybody must write and email and speak to the press and to the papers and websites and so on and so forth. I hate the film " Alien" but at the end of the first one, the heroine succeeds in dislodging the alien creature from the door of the escape capsule and pushing it out into the inky void. It has to be prised off with chemical and biological weapons. Same for Wenger. All real despots have to be hacked off the stage with steely knives and this guy is no different. He feels no humiliation at the club losing. The only thing that matters to him is him, and the only thing that matters to us is that he goes. Let us hope that the players are now fully on board as well. I left the Hull game at half time. The team that I once saw play under the floodlights at Highbury in 1981 is dead. Nothing of interest remains to be seen while Wenger remains. - Post No. 104072

Yes its Ron  12:45pm 16th Feb 2017

Hi Jeff - true mate. Have to laugh at yr 'keystone Kos' name. Youre absolutely right, its almost possible this last yr or so to predict which games and what minute he ll find that mystery pulled hamstring prompting him to slowfoot off the pitch with the feigned 'disapointed' look etched on his face. Its his turning away from the ball that gets to me. He did it again last night to avoid Robbens shot hitting him. Yet, these pundit ex pros sign his praises? Its amazing to hear. Do they really think we re that daft? - Post No. 104074

Aylesbury Gooner  12:55pm 16th Feb 2017

Alsace,love your reference to Alien a great film,but personally i preferred the sequel Aliens so once the Wenger alien goes then a clearout of the others should occur from top to bottom and not a moment too soon.Wenger out,out,out - Post No. 104075

Exeter Gunner  12:57pm 16th Feb 2017

Wenger is like a mini-Trump. A reality denier, a man who makes decisions based not on facts and evidence but on what he 'believes'. So no need to prepare for the opposition, my players are great simply because I chose them and they are my players, they can just go out there and take on Bayern. We've see over and over and over again for years and years and years with the same result against top teams. But none of this evidence matters to Wenger. All that exists in the world is him and his beliefs, so he carries on exactly the same. It will be his undoing (just as it will be Trump's eventually) and hopefully very soon. - Post No. 104076

Paulo75  13:00pm 16th Feb 2017

On a Smiths theme, how about Stop me if you think that you've heard this one before. Nothings changed as a great man once sang - Post No. 104077

jjetplane  13:03pm 16th Feb 2017

Commentator refers to Kosc as 'the general' when he picked up his usual knock and the only other player at Arsenal with such mythical properties is 'if only we had Santi running things.' Arsenal just keep on giving and Muller owes Ox one for getting him back into the team with a goal. The lewandowski assist was world class and there is nothing at Arsenal anywhere near it. Sanchez is not really that great against top opponents even when they are in transitional mode. When Robben decided to stop Wenger in his tracks after 11 minutes you just knew what would happen. Arsenal are so in the bracket of making up the niumbers in Europe it is past a joke. See Robben before the game saying it woould be nice to play someone else instead of the joke that is Arsenal. Another one to add to the joke book is the Ox gift. Priceless. Anyone else notice how Bellerin is no longer a good player? Would be interesting to see if there are any offers for Wenger's star men. Cannot see it and I imagine his contract will tie in with how much money he can make for Stan by selling 'the riches.' What an awful club. - Post No. 104078

Redshirtwhitesleeves  13:11pm 16th Feb 2017

I really hope that the stadium is empty for the pointless return leg. That might help the board towards making the right decision. This man cannot be allowed another season of pure selfish indulgence. He is finished and if he has an ounce of dignity he will announce his departure ASAP. It's not just him though is it. The players (bar Sanchez) should be ashamed of their performances not just last night but over the last few seasons. They are an embarrassment to our club and are as bad as their manager. I would clear the lot out (bar Sanchez - he deserves better than this s***fest and if he were to leave I wouldn't blame him in the slightest). The board need to have a serious look at themselves. There is a lot of work to do and decisions to be made, my worry is their is nobody there who understands football and Arsenal and I fear a long barren spell in the wilderness unless someone is bought in to run the football side of things properly. Still that's a worry for another day, all I want right now is this manger to leave and take that bunch of shirkers and beard groomers with him. - Post No. 104079

Yes its Ron  13:20pm 16th Feb 2017

Red shirts - Gteed 45 - 50000 disciples will still be there that night for the wake. Sanchez is a very honest pro. Hes playing for his move, ive no doubt about that. Underneath i dont thunk results matter that much now as long as he shines. Cant blame him for that approach as you say. - Post No. 104080

Redshirtwhitesleeves  13:21pm 16th Feb 2017

One other thing- seeing that useless t***** Gibbs wearing the captains armband. Unbelievable. How is he even still at our club never mind captain! A prime example of wenger rewarding complacency and under achievement. Makes my blood boil - Post No. 104081

TonyEvans  13:41pm 16th Feb 2017

I'm harbouring dark thoughts about the Sutton game now. I would gladly take the humiliation of going out to a non league side if that loss proved to be the straw that finally rids the club of Wenger. Trouble is I expect the bugger would still cling on even then! - Post No. 104082

Highbury Boy  13:41pm 16th Feb 2017

In truth this performance was not unexpected. Embarrassment came in the first half v Watford when we were totally outplayed. Keown spoke last night about his 20 year work ,his legacy. Keown should be reminded that he played in Rioch's last match at Highbury v Bolton. Pretty defensive set up that day and until Bergkamp scored there was a lot of tension trying to get a European place but the team then was Seaman; Dixon,Keown,Linighan,Marshall,Winterburn:Merson,Platt,Parlour,Bergkamp and Wright. Bould and Adams missing that day.Question: Apart from Sanchez coming in for an ageing Wright who else from last night would get into the side? And no doubt in my mind which team would win. That's the legacy he has left us after 20 years. Oh and I'm not sure if it's a wind up but I saw what purports to be an interview with Martinez who claims he has been given a 6 year contract by Wenger who believes he is the future. In return Martinez believes "Wenger built Arsenal" and "helped buy the stadium". I hate to break it to young Martinez but a) I have seen many young gks at Arsenal from a young Jack Kelsey to a youthful Szczesney and Martinez is never going to be good enough to be Arsenal No.1 and b) hope Martinez is sitting down if he reads this but Wenger didn't actually build Arsenal or the stadium. i know Wenger's first name is similar. Perhaps Martinez still believes in Santa Claus. - Post No. 104083

Cyril  13:51pm 16th Feb 2017

FARSENAL - Post No. 104084

Siddy  13:53pm 16th Feb 2017

There's only one man who should have been given the armband - Sanchez. W***er out NOW. - Post No. 104085

Yes its Ron  13:55pm 16th Feb 2017

HB - Under Wenger hes got every chance of being a No 1 i bet, especially if he did say those things. - Post No. 104086

mbg  14:00pm 16th Feb 2017

Now there's some stats we can all relate to (apart from some) Sad indeed, from a sad old has been, did any AKB wengerite actually think it was going to be different ? did any sad AKB actually think we were going to get something out of it ? even just maybe ? Sad. Go now wenger you sad embarrassment. - Post No. 104087

The Man From UNCLE  14:19pm 16th Feb 2017

As always, football imitates life. Brexit will hopefully see the tearing down of the BBC / Guardianista left liberal wishy washy way of thinking that has poisoned us and our children for long enough. Hopefully also last night will see the same for the old fraud. I genuinely wouldn't be surprised if Sutton finish the job on Monday. - Post No. 104088

mbg  14:26pm 16th Feb 2017

I bet the little nice boy pansies weren't falling over themselves (pun intended)to appear in front of the camera last night to tell us how well they played, and how they made a statement, pathetic the fooking lot of them. Go now wenger you embarrassment. - Post No. 104089

jeff wright  15:13pm 16th Feb 2017

My guess Ron is that the TV pundits see supporters as being idiots who will believe anything .They are right in that view regarding some supporters. Wengo was in good spirits in the tunnel before the kick-off laughing and joking with Ancelotti .However the cunning Italian had not come to praise Caesar but to bury him. Wengo had good reason according to himself that is to feel confident and was looking forward to shaking Ancelotti by the hand while giving him a consolatory condescending pat on the back at the end of the game that Wengo .Wengo believed that he was destined to triumph in. Wenger said before the game that he had spoken to Ozil, other wise known as the wizard of oz, last Friday and asked him if he was feeling well . Wengo was reassured that the wizards poor lack lustre performances were just down to him overdoing the late night clubbing drinking and shagging but he was going to give that a swerve last weekend to be ready to put Bayern Munich to the sword . So with that settled Wengo deduced that we were more than capable of beating Bayern Munich and progressing to the next round at their expense. The cocky smirk though was soon wiped off Wengo's smug mug after just 11 minute when some typical championship class style defending from le coq allowed Robbin an old nemesis of Wengo to rifle a shot into the top corner of the hapless Ospina's goal. The funniest part of the entire farce naturally involved Keystone Kos who went down like a pine tree felled by a lumber-jack after receiving an accidental kick on his leg that could not possibly have produced the drama queen style tumble to the ground that Keystone Kos indulged in. Anyway the reef saw it as being a penalty and then the fun really began in typical Keystone Kopesque style with Woof Woof having his tame penalty kick saved only for the ball to end up coming back unexpectedly to Woof Woof. who then did an hilarious air kick completely missing the ball but unbelievably yet again a German defender mis-kicked his attempted clearance and in the ensuing crazy Rugby type scramble that followed Woof Woof somehow contrived to slice the ball through the pack of panicking Germans to score. Queue a typical Sanchez celeb of self indulgence. This hombre is no team man it's all about himself he obviously does not even like the other players ! Can't blame him for that who would. I noted that the wizard of oz did not dash enthusiastically over to congrat Woof Woof on his amazing good fortune in having scored .The only scoring that the wizard does this days is when he is pulling girls in night clubs.It must be his wonderful charm and personality. - Post No. 104091

mbg  15:16pm 16th Feb 2017

Yes Bayern still had a few gears if needed it really could have been 8 or more as someone has said men v boys or real top top qualittee players v second third raters with a second third rate manager sitting clueless on the bench. wenger out now. - Post No. 104092

CT Gooner  15:37pm 16th Feb 2017

OK Leekey, what positive are we to take from last night. Mine was a sense of the end has come. If the club has any respect for it's fans, they will quickly announce Wenger's leaving at the end of the season. If they don't, I think there will be negative impacts on the relationship with the fans that won't be overcome for a generation. Hey, at least the tourist will get tickets!! - Post No. 104094

Exeter Gunner  15:38pm 16th Feb 2017

Quite right UNCLE! we need to stop rule by the BBC/Guardian PC brigade!! Let's get some good old fashioned racism and sexism back in the UK. Why shouldn't you be allowed to call people who don't look like you or sound like you names if you want to? Let's bring down Wenger and bring back the 70s! - Post No. 104095

mbg  15:49pm 16th Feb 2017

Hands up the AKB wengerites who think we can still pull it out of the bag ? we'd love to hear from you, tee, lol. - Post No. 104096

The Man From UNCLE  16:15pm 16th Feb 2017

MBG here's a stat that shows we are still making progress. Last year we were 3-0 down at half time. Last night it was 1-1 at half time - an improvement statistic of 50% in the points stakes, and also a whopping 300% in the goal difference. Which must mean we're 350% better than last season. I know, I should get a job at a quango -they like lots of statistics. Well, they have to have something to do now they'll all soon be out of a job. - Post No. 104097

jeff wright  16:44pm 16th Feb 2017

mbg,Roy Keane was right when he said after the farce was over that Wenger's put together a side of average players that get out of their depth every season when they play in the first KO round in Europe. 7 years now on the trot,donkeys years of course,of failure to get past the first KO stage is no coincidence. Wengo the specialist in failure paid a lot of money for these current players and our wage bill for the flops is the same as Chelsea's one. Big difference though in trophies won over the past 7 years between us and the blues. This is down to Wengo himself old clueless the odd fella in the crowd the loner Monsieur Arrogance know it all Arsene Wenger .At any other club he would have been history long ago and yet the clown is still lurking with us talking sh*te and producing it on the field of play He is an embarrassment to AFC to English football and to himself .Only a weird loony lack of any self awareness keeps the ageing oaf still going .If the club had any decency they would refund the fans who went to support the team in Germany their money back. Problem is it would set a dangerous and costly precedence because their is sure to be more of these humiliations to come before the Fat Bird sings. The big problem with getting shut of hapless clueless Wengo is that Syrupy Stan back on the ranch in the good ol U.S of A loves Wengo and seeing as the cretin is not interested in winning trophies but happy as Sancho's two dogs with a pair of bitches on heat is just happy to allow Wengo to meander along in mediocrity providing that Chumps League dosh is there every season. Greedy money mad grabber Syrupy is not going to fire Wengo .According to some reports there is a new 2 year contract and natch pay rise on the table right now waiting on Wengo signing it. You couldn't make it up. - Post No. 104098

ipearce  16:46pm 16th Feb 2017

Was this piece written before the match or afterwards? Sorry but if I didn't laugh I would cry! - Post No. 104099

Arseneknewbest  16:49pm 16th Feb 2017

Alsace and Aylesbury (if ever there were two exotic locations to get one's wanderlust flowing...) Your conversation about wengo and the sci-fi genre made me wonder is he isn't a bit more like the Dan Ackroyd character in "Coneheads" which my kids and I love. Ackroyd plays an alien who, along with his intergalactic other half, land and settle in some sh*thole in 80s new jersey. Despite having a fleshy bollard thing on his napper, metal pointy teeth (good for eating soap and munching on toilet rolls), and an arse with no bum-crack, the hapless locals do not suspect his other-worldliness. Only when questioned by US immigration does Ackroyd reveal, "We come from France". It's celluloid wengo! Kev: I love the Smiths tie in. It adds some extra pathos to an already very sad situation. Heaven Knows I'm miserable now, Panic (on the streets of Holloway), or for Ozil, the boy with the thorn in his foot. Wengo's post-match interview was revealing - eyes like pinholes, evasiveness personified and a sense that his brain was about to explode. He looked ill, ill, ill! Never mind, he'll soon be getting his £750,000 monthly pay slip which will assuage the pain I'm sure. When should wengo leave? - How soon is now? - Post No. 104100

markymark  17:01pm 16th Feb 2017

I love the way that Untold is dealing with the issue. Precisely nothing , no report and only one comment from a bewildered patron asking "where has every one gone?" It's like the Day after Tomorrow. Just thought I would add that even the Nazis reflected on the defeat at Stalingrad by playing Bruckners 7th Symphony (adagio). Tony has decided to favour the Kim Il Jong Route by making it non news. - Post No. 104102

Redshirtwhitesleeves  17:05pm 16th Feb 2017

Ron- I guess you are right mate, there's enough brain dead sheep that keep turning up at that god awful stadium no matter what! It's a shame we haven't got a team that ever turns up, but we are well used to that after this last waste of a decade - Post No. 104103

Arseneknewbest  17:07pm 16th Feb 2017

The Man from from Uxbridge - You're more Napoleon Dynamite than Napoleon Solo! If you voted Brexit to get rid of the guardian and the bbc (both of which are widely regarded as centre-right, pro-establishment organs these days) then you are simply living in a world of green knob cheese. Nick Robinson, Laura Kuenssberg, Andrew Marr, Andreww Neill all terribly dangerous lefties....By voting for Brexit, you and that numpty Jeff extrem-right have joined me in helping to bring a right-wing, pro-business, undemocratic, racist superstate (the eu) to a shuddering halt. Take a bow - you're helping the UK take a major step towards a socialist, multicultural future where workers control the means of production! There'll be racists, bigots and nutjobs along the way, but you and swivel eyed Jeff won't mind being put on the barricades and featuring in show trials will you? You voted correctly (hooray) but for all the wrong reasons. Doh....where's that can of Duff beer? - Post No. 104104

Highbury Boy  17:30pm 16th Feb 2017

Shouldn't Gary Neville apologise to the fan who he called an idiot because he wanted change of manager? Gary Neville wants Wenger to stay because of his "incredible philosophy". What's so incredible about being hammered 5-1 except I suppose 6-0 or 8-2 is worse.It's clear his sympathy is not with fans but with the manager. - Post No. 104105

Moscowgooner  17:40pm 16th Feb 2017

The most effective time to protest would be if and when Wenger signs an extension. The anger will be intense. Next home game - walk out on the 13th minute symbolising seasons since the last league title and then stay in the concourses until half time. The impact on TV would be dramatic but noone needs to get into punch ups etc with (any remaining) Wenger loyalists over this. Would send an immensely powerful message to Kroenke and co. And I suggest this needs to continue game after game until Wenger is gone. - Post No. 104106

Roy  17:42pm 16th Feb 2017

Before any AKB's post in with their own Smiths analogy "These Things Take Time",I would like to point out that the next line is " I know that I'm, the most inept that ever stepped ". Remind you of anyone ? Just saying. Sutton must be quaking...NOT ! - Post No. 104107

mbg  18:48pm 16th Feb 2017

jw, spot on, bog standard is indeed what they are, spun by TOF to be top top qualittee (and of course believed by the AKB sheep, good against the Bournemouth's palaces, etc, etc, etc, of this world but thats it, and of course it helps the illusion when you pay them over inflated contracts, then the second raters believe it themselves, wally, gibbs, kos, carthorse, ramsey, etc, etc, etc,) reasons being he wouldn't know a top player, he wouldn't know what to do with them, he wouldn't know how to coach them and he wouldn't want any about him who knows more and is better than himself, and would speak his/their mind and tell him what he/they thought, just like the coaching set up, with all the ex Arsenal players Ron mentioned he over looked for coaching positions. The man is a f****g fraud and so it has been proved yet again (what more proof do his luvvies want? ) but thankfully he's being found out now with wengerites and even his luvvies waking up, yes the pigeons are coming home to roost now and not before time, it's been long time coming he's been getting away with it for far far to long, and indeed allowed to and helped, the end is nigh now and it's long long over due. wenger out now. - Post No. 104108

markymark  19:04pm 16th Feb 2017

It's all very well these "Arsene it's time to go" banners but we really do need further emphasis. I suggest. "Arsene it's time to go, as we can only remain polite for so long" Or "Arsene it's time to go, before it gets brutal!" With apologies for all involved with the production of bigger banner, sticky tape etc with the bigger signs. Oh yes can we add something about that awful chap Gazidis. - Post No. 104109

Leek fc  19:59pm 16th Feb 2017

Lots of criticism. Very little action. Plastic armchair fans tend to get very vocal but do nothing when push comes to shove. Bonzo and all of his aliases did nothing last time eh mark. Clearly, you don't want Mr Wenger out. It's all huff and puff. Fan power . Ppppfffff. - Post No. 104110

CORNISH GOONER  20:21pm 16th Feb 2017

I'm afraid to say that as I get older the more cynical I become. Frankly, I do not believe any statement or news plant from the Club/Corporation which gives hope of the change which pretty much every true supporter is demanding. This is Wenger World we are talking about & Walt, sorry Stanley, is very happy. So we have to find ways to pressurise, to protest. Any chance of a combined on-line petition? Excepting Untold, surely the major sites, co-ordinated, could muster a formidable list of names - making sure that it's presentation got max meeja coverage? Excellent post as usual KW. - Post No. 104111

KC38  20:22pm 16th Feb 2017

Thanks Kevin , good report as usual. It's all been said, pathetic comes to mind sadly totally expected. It's so obvious that we concede to many goals against all opposition and yet no change, no thought, no chance. We have such a great fan base, true supporters that attend games home and away, many are proper supporters that have been with the club for so long. They are not just keyboard warriors, and deserve a club that makes winning trophies it's one and only priority. It's so frustrating the club has so much potential to be the second biggest club in the country and a giant in Europe, sadly we have a board that has bought out the manager and has become a money making machine for the owner. Totally depressing for true honest supporters. - Post No. 104112

markymark  21:04pm 16th Feb 2017

Squeak - he's gone sunshine. Lost it mentally, team not playing for him. - Post No. 104114

jeff wright  21:22pm 16th Feb 2017

Exeter ,Bercow made his Trump self publicity seeking comments on the 7th of this month it's the 16th today so not a couple of weeks but over a week okay if you want to nit-pick. You show me where you called Bercow a Tory hypocrite before yesterday .You can't because you were supporting him and are now trying to pretend otherwise . So why are you doing this if you knew that Bercow was a Tory hypocrite you certainly did a good job of not revealing it .AKB claims that Bercow is a man with more integrity than the Tories - read his post yesterday - he also seemed unaware that Bercow was a Tory himself and he has all of the brains that god gave a duck's arse, AKB that is not Bercow ,he doesn't have any brains at all... Trump's views on Mexicans look to be racially motivated but banning some Muslim's from certain areas of the middle east is not racism it could be construed as being religious intolerance at a pich but just looks to be more about security issues. A bit heavy handed though and no surprise as many of us expected that Trumpo can't enforce his ban. Why so many lefty types in this country got so worked up about it when Corbo their idol voted for a mass ban on all immigrants from the EU and the end of free movement of Labour recently without any lefties raising any real objections other than some phony resignations from Corbo's front bench is something that only they know.The difference being that Trump's ban on some Muslims will never happen while Corbo's one to ban some Muslims and lots of others from coming here will happen . C'est la vie. - Post No. 104115

Leek fc  21:27pm 16th Feb 2017

Just admit it bell end. He's only gone in your eyes. You want him out...... do something about it. You, yes you are filling the cash cow with your silver membership. God only knows how your son feels. When my grandfather and father introduced me to the Arsenal...... we were ****, **** and more **** but I loved the days at Highbury. But I'm still here through thick and thin. You've made your bed. Do something about it...... Where's mad monk when you need him. IDIOT - Post No. 104116

Leek fc  21:43pm 16th Feb 2017

Absolute piss poor attempt to keep blaming the manager. The 60's, 70's and 80's were sh1t. But we kept going. Mark/Bonzo/squeak/mad monk and whoever he feels to name himself. You would not have lasted a game on the north bank. Plastic, armchair supporters on this site are a disgrace. Time for change ??????? Prove it or shut the **** up. - Post No. 104117

markymark  21:51pm 16th Feb 2017

Squeak - you're getting a bit tetchy think you know bad news is coming , no one, simplyno one is backing him. His arch apologists like Keown have flown the nest. Now keep on saying Mr Wenger, Mr Wenger and it will all go away..... Not! - Post No. 104118

Leek fc  22:05pm 16th Feb 2017

Bell end. How's the demo going. Sorry son . Your balls ain't big enough. - Post No. 104119

Arseneknewbest  22:08pm 16th Feb 2017

Jeff extreme-right. Re-read my post thicko. I had a thirty year career in and around Westminster so I think I know my stuff. I compared Bercow to three fellow Tories and made that comment. I also heard a pretty interesting piece about him on Radio Four this week while you were reading the daily mail and sending off for a douche syringe. You right wing crybaby. - Post No. 104120

mbg  22:17pm 16th Feb 2017

markymark, yes I've no doubt he's lost the dressing room, in fact he lost it some time ago, it's just that no player wants to come out with it, none of them want to be the whistle blower, especially as they have it so cushy here so well paid with no pressure, something they're never going to get again, and they don't want that reputation on their CV as they know their going to have enter another dressing room and work with another manager/managers, and as well as that they also know TOF will probably move upstairs and he's still going to be around giving him/them the evil eye, and no doubt with still friends in high places. wenger out now. - Post No. 104121

clarky  22:20pm 16th Feb 2017

I can't believe all these numpties saying it's the players fault and not Wenger. Who do they think signed these players and coaches them? Also, are they all 10 years old or have they forgotten that these "mental weakness" arguments have regularly been cited by Wenger for all our most embarrassing defeats for the last 10 years or more? Do they not see a common link? What is wrong with people? - Post No. 104122

Exeter Gunner  22:32pm 16th Feb 2017

Jeff, the subject of Bercow didn't even come up on this site before yesterday. You've got nothing and have been thoroughly shown up but still you keep going at it like a dog with an imaginary bone. You should know when to give it up. You are clearly unhinged. - Post No. 104123

markymark  22:34pm 16th Feb 2017

Squeak - not more ofvthe testicle inflation / deflation obsession of your tiresome and now dormant buddy Jamerson. I suspect your balls shrunk resembling Wengo's wrinkly face as the goals piled in and Wengo's end time began. - Post No. 104124

jeff wright  22:40pm 16th Feb 2017

AKB, you standing outside Westminster Underground Station for 30 years trying to sell copies of the Daily Worker to normal folk who don't want to buy it does not constitute having any great insight into the murky political world of Westminster. Anyway for someone with an alleged 30 years experience of Westminster it's odd that yesterday you posted that " Calm down dears. I know little about tories but stood next to the likes of Boris, Liam Fox and Gove, I'd say Bercow had ten times the personal integrity of those three tossers. " So you know little about Tories despite all that experience and actually having stood next to them. Of course you could have been the Raving Loony Party Candidate for Westminster and that would explain you standing next to Bojo and co. Hey come on now please , Bercow doesn't have ANY integrity let alone 30 times more than his previous fellow Tories. It will be fun though watching Bercow moo moo on celeb Big Brother he will be the Tories reply to the well bent leftie George Galloway who provided so much amusement meow when he was on the nonsensical but money for fun show ... I'll wager you love old ex-pal of Saddam and his psychotic sons money for nothing and the drinks are free Georgie ! - Post No. 104125

Arseneknewbest  22:48pm 16th Feb 2017

Jeff extreme right - Arsenal's answer to Alf Garnett. You are a complete buffoon. - Post No. 104126

GoonerGoal!  22:53pm 16th Feb 2017

Paddy Power are currently offering 16/1 for Sutton Utd to beat Arsenal on a tacky semi-pro pitch on a breezy Monday night with the possibility of rain falling... Well worth a £20 bet! WENGER OUT! GAZIDIS OUT! KROENKE OUT! VIVE LA REVOLUTION! - Post No. 104127

jeff wright  22:54pm 16th Feb 2017

Come of it Exeter you were slavering like a dog over a tin of Chum on here after Bercow made his anti-Trump comments ! Is that it AKB ,best give up comrade ,you really are struggling even though you can't see it - but hey I guess self awareness in not one of your strong points what ! - Post No. 104128

Leek fc  23:04pm 16th Feb 2017

Bell end. Bottled it yet again. Time for change ????. "IDIOT " - Post No. 104129

Arseneknewbest  23:15pm 16th Feb 2017

Jeff I actually spent a good deal of time helping to try and bring down that particular regime. You won't be able to imagine it from your armchair but it was long hours, nasty subject matter and time spent in places (including in Iraq itself) that I'd rather forget. So what did you do during the war? Do tell. I took pride in what I did but knowing that it helps to maintain a society that gives you the liberty to spout your venal dogsh*t on here Makes me seriously wonder if it was worth it. Reading the Daily Mail doesn't make you a patriot Jeff - rather it makes you an islamophobe; a liar; and a fascist sympathiser. - Post No. 104130

Exeter Gunner  23:15pm 16th Feb 2017

Jeff - I'm starting to pity you now. You clearly have mental health issues. AKBest - from now on I'll hear Alfs voice whenever I read Jeff's contributions. Leek - AFC changed managers on a number of occasions thru the 60s 70s 80s. Sorry to break this to you but it does and will happen. - Post No. 104131

mbg  23:16pm 16th Feb 2017

clarky, well said, unfortunately there's still some who just can't see (or just don't want to)and can't let go such is their love for TOF, but mark my words, just like some are already doing, they'll soon change their tune and jump on the band wagon when we're up and running again with our self respect back, and their messiah will just be a memory to them, but like I've said before their part in all this won't and never will be forgotten, and they'll be reminded of it on plenty of occassions. wenger out now. - Post No. 104132

jjetplane  0:41am 17th Feb 2017

Anyway, as a remainer it was great to see Muller get on the scoresheet though Untold reckon if Per had played it would have been a different match. Anyway , great stuff from Bayern and Arsenal really were worth every penny as the fall guys. They are so well versed in it that it is now post-pantomime ... Bellerin is like a meek sheep in some far flung field and Ozil's agent is now rocking the boat which is not a good thing to do when your doey eyed boy wants a 1m plus a month. Just to add love the Guardian and BBC whom i [partake of daily and the Late Show stuff on the orange Dope is comedy gold. **** Brexit! - Post No. 104133

Rob Admin  0:44am 17th Feb 2017

Arsenal has a holiday camp feel about it today, show-up see how it goes, no retribution if you don't perform or put a shift in. - Post No. 104134

UTU The Arsenal FC  1:38am 17th Feb 2017

When has a Top Manager stayed in post after an 8-2 defeat. How many times have Arsenal been thrashed under Wenger who is going no where unless the profits dry up. Arsenal fans moan on AFTV and online but still give the parasites who own/manage Arsenal PLC their money. Most Old School Fans stopped going years ago. The club have become are a complete fiasco under the Kroneke Wenger Regime ! - Post No. 104135

The Man From UNCLE  5:56am 17th Feb 2017

If anyone needs a good laugh today I recommend that you head over to Untold Arsenal and pick up the comments of the thread "Bayern - Arsenal 5-1" where the overriding impression seems to be one of slightly mild annoyance but nevertheless tacit acceptance at the result. - Post No. 104136

markymark  8:24am 17th Feb 2017

Squeak - a few things you're Squeak not me, so when you're accusing me of being Squeak it's rather odd. First attended Arsenal 1976 with Dad. Was sat on the crush barriers with Dad making sure I didn't fall off. That was the Northbank and continued to stand on the Northbank more or less to the end. It's barely worth the juvenile baiting to respond. However the Silver is held so that when Wengo goes and we now highly suspect from next season, the fun starts again. When the boy is 6 then he's coming along too. I've got a feeling you don't have kids by the way and live with your mum. In terms of getting into headlong disputes I've mentioned this before but I hold a role where if I engage in public protests and something goes wrong I lose my job. I find the general social media outcry to be far more effective anyway and not going means I don't put money in the coffers. You will never believe this and you will continue no doubt to call me whatever you wish. Suffice to say on average about once a week we have to deal with an arrest or usher out a potentially aggressive customer. During Christmas we had to deal with a domestic violence incident. I also personally had to barrier a customer who attempted to breach our security. I also was trapped with a wildly gesticulating customer I got him out by threats of police action. But do you know what when the games up they often bolt off as their anger gives way to fear. You will probably never guess what job I do as most people would be shocked that we get this sort of behaviour. Now unless your in some sort of high risk role, action adventurer. I'm really thinking you are a keyboard warrior who probably works in a mundane local authority somewhere processing Parking fines. - Post No. 104137

markymark  8:57am 17th Feb 2017

Papers reporting that team has split with the Ox giving players an ear bashing (well deserved). I've noticed Ozils spokesman is whining in the media about it being unfair on Mezut. I suspect we are going to get more of this until Wengo goes. - Post No. 104138

shu  12:00pm 17th Feb 2017

Kev , what makes u think that they are looking for a replacement ? - Post No. 104147

jeff wright  12:49pm 17th Feb 2017

Exeter, for someone who claims not to share all the same views as AKB you sure do look to lean on each other like drunks do on lamp-posts when stumbling back home after a night down the local.You sing from the same song-sheet that hypocrite Tory Bercow does on Trump and posted views on here about Trump a couple of days ago that you contrived to work into a post where the subject was nothing to do with Trump. AKB the Iraq wars had nothing to do with my right to free speech in this country they were wars that the Tory and Labour governments launched for political reasons. We know that Blair lied about the alleged WOMD excuse that he used but hey what's new there ! - Post No. 104152

Exeter Gunner  13:25pm 17th Feb 2017

So Jeff, you've now shifted positions from me 'supporting and praising' Bercow to 'singing from the same songsheet'. I'll express this as clearly as I can: Yes, I do not think Trump should get a State visit, with the stay and Buck House and the ride in the Queen's carriage that that entails - just as I think numerous other leaders that have been afforded that privilege in the past should not have been. However, I do not think Bercow holds that view about Trump for any moral reasons but out of self-interest and self-promotion. This has been my position all along, I have not shifted or deviated from it, as you have been attempting to claim. I hope this has been expressed in simple enough terms now to bring a measure of peace to your mental torment and you can now move on - or do I still need to call the men in white coats? They are offering a nice padded room and all the free mashed banana you can eat. - Post No. 104156

jeff wright  14:02pm 17th Feb 2017

I'm not buying your explanation on your views on Bercow Exter. Can you show me a post BEFORE the one you made after I had exposed Bercows hypocrisy and obvious self interest on here in which YOU aired those views you express now on Bercow.If not then I think that you protest too much and should give it a swerve.You were quick to jump on me and TMFU when we pointed out Bercow's hypocrisy and uselessness but no comments on your chum AKB's ones praising Bercow and claiming that he was a man of integrity. Typical left wing tunnel-vision at work here . Blimey you really could not make it up. - Post No. 104164

Exeter Gunner  14:18pm 17th Feb 2017

My god Jeff you are unbelievable. There are only the posts there are on Bercow. My position was constant. Show me where I was praising him. Point it out. What I jumped on was your and MFU's right wing twattery. AKBest's take on Bercow is his own. He isn't a right wing bigot so I don't jump on him. Bercow didn't come up before you brought him up - so that's the substance of your accusation, that I hadn't brought him up on this site beforehand just randomly. That is truly pathetic. You are a hopeless case and shall be ignored from now on. - Post No. 104165

jeff wright  14:35pm 17th Feb 2017

Exeter, for someone who claims that I am too dumb to understand your posts you do a good job of not understanding my ones! Again you accuse me of being some sort of right wing nutter over my alleged views on Trump .So just for the record I do not support his travel ban on Muslims and said so when he tried to impose it.I think it is divisive and counter-productive and ill-thought out. Now are you following this. I said that I had no problem with Bercow banning Trump from parliament but that he had not done similar with worse leaders than Trump and that Bercow was just an opportunist jumping on the anti-Trump bandwagon that is full of the usual suspects ,left wing liberals and luvvie protest rent a mob types with very selective targets that they get worked up about . Your chum the rather ebullient and over aggressive AKB however accused me of being a right wing nutter for my views on Bercow you claim to have differences with him on some matters,probaly no more than he likes Ketchup on his Big Mac and you prefer mustard.You even suggested that I be banned from this forum because of my 'right-wing extremist views' !I suggest that you try engaging your brain before posting in future because you are obviously not safe to be let loose on your own. - Post No. 104166

Exeter Gunner  15:17pm 17th Feb 2017

No Jeff, it's not your views on Bercow that mark you out as very right wing, it's your use of terms like 'lefty liberals' and 'luvvies' and 'rent a mob' straight from the right wing gutter press that mark out where you stand. There's also your obsession with 'Corbo' whom you seem to feel very threatened by. All this indicates a closed mind, impervious to and incurious about the reality of situations (e.g. the broad range of people worldwide who are against Trump), paranoid and suspicious. It's impossible to engage you in proper debate because you fall upon these ill-thought out tropes, which is why I shan't bother to try again. I have not called for you or anyone else to be banned but I do think it would a good idea for gooner.ed to stop any of us using this site as a platform for political views from now on, there are more appropriate places. Let's stick to Arsenal and Wenger from now on. - Post No. 104172

Yes its Ron  15:19pm 17th Feb 2017

This Bercow? Hes not a hard tackling, physically imposing, ground eating, centre midfielder is he by any chance? He sounds expensive. - Post No. 104173

jeff wright  15:28pm 17th Feb 2017

Ron, Bercow is another lightweight Wally and if Ozil is the wizard of Oz then Wally is our Shirley Temple . There is a touch of the wishful thinking yellow brick roads about AFC these days somewhere over the rainbow Wengo playing the part of the Tin Man making all Syrupy and the suits dreams of making money come true. Shame about the trophies. - Post No. 104174

Arseneknewbest  16:18pm 17th Feb 2017

Jeff the crybaby still crapping on about Bercow. Here it is in simple terms which you need to try to understand before your daily sedation kicks in. Bercow (still a Tory, and formerly a raving extremist one like you Jeff, but now more moderate - remember I sometimes listen to R4) is a cnut but at least he expressed some principles about the HoP being an unfit forum in which to let your orange buddy expound his rabid world view. I was comparing him to FELLOW tories gove, bojo and fox who are by anyone's yardstick except yours and some other swivel eyed twatz, even bigger cnuts. Geddit now Jeff you thicko? I see you didn't answer my question Mr. armchair hardman about what you got up to in the 90s. Painted your shed? Finished that airfix model of your messerschmidt? Helped Mrs Jeff peel the potatoes? And I hate to disagree but there is a link between what governments do and how this plays out at home - you'd be an idiot to think otherwise. For my sins, I've also been closely involved in organising state visits in the past, not least your mate Obama's in 2011. The difference between him and his successor could not be more stark and when Obama talked to the HoP it was full to the gunnels and tickets could not be had. If that dreaded mate of yours turns up, they'll probably invite you and Nick Griffin to try and fill the hall. What was WWII all about for you Jeff? I suspect you're one of those hypocrites who wanted the Jerries to lose while latterly becoming a devotee of what they stood for in the 1930s. As you laughingly repeat like a mantra Jeff, you couldn't make it up. Although in your world of insatiable bullsh*t, I guess you do. If you've got any more comeback on this, post your address and I'll be happy to come round and discuss it in more detail. Otherwise, like other right-wing chicken hawks tend to do, you now need to be quiet. - Post No. 104181

jeff wright  17:17pm 17th Feb 2017

Oh hum,the problem with the Bercow is now a moderate claims and has 30 times more integrity than other Tories silly billy AKB is that that his alleged anti-Trump rhetoric was obviously a fraud and just a self interest seeking ploy that only a thick twit like you would fall for. You really do come over as being very deluded in the opinions that you arrive at.Best as your pal Exeter - who sensibly I must add - doesn't agree with you on Bercow - says and give the politics a swerve sunbeam. You might feel a bit better for it because you are obviously one very angry hombre! You couldn't make it up.Where you are concerned there is no need to do so. - Post No. 104185

Arseneknewbest  17:34pm 17th Feb 2017

Jeff - You crybaby f*ckwit. If you asked people in Britain what they thought of Bercows's comments about your orange friend coming over here a good number - a possibly a majority - would agree that Bercow was right and that the HoP does not deserve to be stained by Trump's greasy orange slug trail. You, on the other hand, would be happy to bathe in it I'm sure. Only you and your extremist buddies think the visit is a good idea. Exeter makes huge amounts of sense whenever he writes and I really respect his stuff. He's balanced and can obviously back up his views with evidence (know what that is Jeff?). You, on the other hand, regurgitate cold sick from the Daily Mail and your intemperate, trolling pieces about Corbyn are testament to that. But why let the truth or human decency get in the way of a pernicious cowardly lie eh Jeff or should I say Alf? Now f*ck off - you're really boring me. - Post No. 104188

Exeter Gunner  19:16pm 17th Feb 2017

Respect back to you, ArseneKB. I get where you're coming from - saying Bercow has more integrity than other Tories is hardly the most ringing of endorsements... a man can be right, even if for the wrong motives. All a bit too nuanced for some I guess. Anyway, if he's out of a job soon perhaps Bercow can take over from Wenger? I reckon he could keep AFC in the top 4. There again I reckon my cat could manage that. - Post No. 104193

jeff wright  11:36am 18th Feb 2017

How do you know AKB that the majority of people in the UK would vote to ban trump. That's just your view and not a fact .How about the Commie President of China,the Saudi Royal Family,Putin, how will Corbo get on when he has to face a vote from the people.That is if he is futilely trying to lead the Labour party and is no certainty. How did Remain get on in the referendum they were according to the polls and 'experts' supposed to have won. I couldnt care less if more or less want Trup banned from the UK or not when so many other worse leaders are welcomed by seen the light now Bercow and co .Obviously though you have a more selective view on these matters you really are rather dense. - Post No. 104215

Arseneknewbest  17:04pm 18th Feb 2017

Jeff you're proving to be a real dunce - a lightweight baby-reactionary and a sh*tter to boot. See the third line - the clue's in the word "possibly". FFS Jeff, we really need to meet up so I can put you straight on a few things. Armchair Hardman - you're being coy about your 90s heroics. You should've f*cked off to Zionlandia with your missus - your postings on here have been truly excremental you useless cowardly jerk-off. Come on be a man. - Post No. 104221

Issue #269 - Out Now!

Gooner Editorial

16th February 2018

Frozen North Provides Relief For Arsenal

Rare comfortable away win for Gunners v Ostersunds